Re: Asimov Site

[Liam Busey <buseyl@my-deja.com>]

Lewin A.R.W. Edwards wrote:
> 
>>>      What will happen is this ...  One or more new Asimov sites will >>> be established on ISPs that care more about staying in business than >>> pleasing whining emailers. Complaints
>>
>> Sigh.
> 
> Sigh indeed. Both of you are ignoring the fact that even if US-hosted
> archives can be harassed out of existence, the busybodies have no > chance of achieving the same end in (say) Russia or Eastern Europe. > The US Government is not going to launch a first strike against Russia > for hosting "illegal" abandonware sites. No matter how much you people > bitch, the US Government wouldn't even cut backbone connections.

True. By the same token I doubt the US would lift a finger to protect
said sites. That however is beside the point. 

The 'busybodies' know it's impossible to shut down all the sites. Even
if they could it would be pointless because people who want to pirate
will always find a way. Instead, they are trying to spread awareness
that such sites are illegal and that despite the fact that there's a
snowball's chance in hell of getting prosecuted, it's valuable to
respect the copyrights of older software.

 
> The vicious politics, stickybeaking and interference in the Apple II
> "community" are unbelievable (and without comparison in the 8-bit > nostalgia world);

One may take it as a sign of health. People don't become so empassioned
over something that's dead (like most other 8bit platforms).
 
> you remind me of neighbors who are constantly spying over each
> other's fences looking for something to complain about.

Noone's spying. Comp.sys.apple2 is a public forum. If you post
flame-bait don't be surprised if get bit.

> The last time I was exposed to this was in early 1995, but I see that > absolutely nothing has changed in the last five years. 

It's normally not this bad. We had about a year of peace but that got
too boring so we had a huge flamewar last month. This thread is just
some leftover fallout. Please stick around a bit.

> I wonder if this is because the Apple II was for a long time the 
> "educator's computer". Perhaps those people who are currently looking > for new ways to harass others should step back for a moment and ... 
> WHOA Toto - we aren't in the playground any more! You will not become > teacher's pet for telling on the naughty boy.

Damn! You got me. Oops potty mouth. ;) 


> Wake up and realize how irredeemably pathetic you are. 

You're hurting my feelings. Stop or I'm telling. ;)

> I realize that most of you are just attention-seekers deriving some 
> kind of satisfaction from the attention of all the people telling you > how futile your existence is, but just think how much more attention 
> you could get if you (say) RAN one of those archive sites.

While I can only speak for myself, I doubt anyone in the Apple 2
community sticks around to get attention. Posting to .advocacy groups
would be much more effective. The people you appear to oppose are just
defending copyright. The only reason there's so much noise here is
because a lot of people won't aknowledge it's validity and get pissed
whenever someone tells them that they're violating it.
 
> When I think of the Apple II community, I think of numerous crotchety > old people testily waving their Zimmer frames at people walking past 
> their front lawn. "Listen sonny, in my day you had to pay rent to walk > across that piece of footpath. I remember in 1893, I used to charge 
> two shillings a head for cattle driven across there." 

Unfortunate.

> The culprits in this also seem to be (in the main) people with mostly > empirical knowledge and little or no real "I hacked that system" > association with the II line.

If your talking about the group that's commonly lumped in with vogons,
many of them are or have been Apple 2 developers. However I fail to see
how a user's (I assume that's what you meant by empirical knowledge)
opinion has any less value than a programmer's.
 
> I'm almost ashamed to have Apple II equipment in my vintage 
> collection, considering the company it puts me in. (And obviously I am > not talking about all Apple II users there). The people I'm talking 
> about know who they are, and the sooner you people move on to less 
> harmful occupations, the better the world will be.

Why be shamed? Regardless of what its users do the Apple II is
blameless. Your quarrel is with people of an opposing view point. Why
project negative feelings towards the hardware just because people you
dislike enjoy the same thing?

Lewin, you've been gone 5 years. Comp.sys.apple2 is a much more pleasant
place. Please don't leave again until you've seen what we're normally
like.

Liam Busey