Re: vogons vs turlettes

["Arkain" <rwking@no.usa.spam.net>]

Quantum_Cat <anonymous@cotse.com> wrote in message
200007242127.RAA18811@anon.cotse.com">news:200007242127.RAA18811@anon.cotse.com...
>
> Hiya, Arkain.
>
>  *>Quantum_Cat,
>
>  *>    Your responses to Bob were reasonable and surprisingly
> quite civil given
>  *>you posting record. Let me see if I can create a scenario
> that fit's the
>  *>problem Bob is trying to describe. Note that although this
> scenario isn't
>  *>specific to the A2 community, similar problems occur
> surrounding the
>  *>"abandonware".
>
> Uh.. Do you mean John?  I've been sort of snotty to Bob
> because he continues to "fabricate untruths" and generally
> act like a kid.

No... I meant you. Except for this thread, the vast majority of the posts
that I've read that were from you(the real you and not the imposter) were
simply inflamatory, sometimes without reason.... but that's just my
observation.

>  *>You already know that in the PC industry there are devices
> marked "Windows
>  *>Only" which are designed in such a way that the necessary
> components to make
>  *>it work generically exist as software with which the
> holding company will
>  *>only support Window. Many people would like to see these
> modems come with
>  *>Linux drivers but the manufacturers refuse. This leaves
> the Linux user w/ a
>  *>problem.
>
> OK.  I'll just interject that when I was confronted with a
> modem purchase, I thought this was one of the stupidest
> things I'd ever heard of an spent more money for a real
> modem.  Works fine on a GS, Mac, PC, AND Linux.  ;)
>
> But continue...

Ah... but how quickly you forget that novices, beginners, and most
intermediates tend to buy pre-built computers, and most pre-build systems
come with WinModems...

>
>  *>Barring the options of a)buying a new modem (lack of
> funds) and b)moving
>  *>back to Windows(do I even need to explain?) these are the
> only remaining
>  *>options:
>
>  *>1) Reverse engineer the Windows driver -
>  *>    Lack of time and skill as well as copyright laws
> interfere with this
>  *>option.
>
> Oh?  Laser did Reverse Engineering on Apple's ROMS and it
> passed copyright.  Franklin didn't and got nailed of course.
> Still your other points may have merit.  Why spend hours of
> valuable time on programming a driver when you can go work
> for McDonalds for the equivalent time and earn enough for a
> GOOD modem.  ;)

That was back when reverse-engineering was considered a valid practice. Now
because of all the misused patents and copyrights, reverse-engineering is
considered in the same light as program cracking and pirating. All things
considered, I make a reasonable living at my job, but given my expenses and
bills, I can't even afford a $35 CDROM drive, let alone a $135 modem! I've
already got a good hardware modem, but there are too others many who are
stuck.

<snipped>
>  *>The A2 corollary is in that there does exist A2 software
> that has a "no
>  *>resale" clause in it meaning that it is illegal to sell
> the software to a
>  *>second party. Likewise it is illegal to be in posession of
> second-hand
>  *>software. With this kind of condition in a commercial
> package that is no
>  *>longer being sold or supported, then there is no legal
> means of attaining
>  *>such software. Likewise, if this software provides some
> important function
>  *>that is highly difficult to replicate, and there is no
> other software
>  *>packages that can achieve the same desired results, then
> you're basically
>  *>stuck.
>
> Ah.  We've been talking about this on another thread.  My
> take on the matter is that such agreements are unenforcable.
> Feel free to buy used software.  ;)

Ah, but they are enforceable. The portion of the clause that says that the
license is in effect after you break the shrink-wrap or seal is
unenforceable, but if you continue to use the software, then you have agreed
to abide by the terms of the license. In that case, if the license has a no
resale clause, then you cannot legally re-sell the package. You can only
legally re-sell the package if you didn't use the package.

>  *>Fortunately, this doesn't happen in the A2 community very
> often, but it does
>  *>happen. So how do you work around this?
>
> I've never heard of an instance where it DID happen.  I hope
> you can clarify that.  As far as working around it, I'll  go
> with what most courts have decided, at least until the
> Supreme Court gets around to hearing the case.

It's been to long. I can tell you that of the thousands of different
packages written for the A2 series, less than 100 had this type of license.
Many of these were also 1/2 track copy protected.

>  *>BTW: What do you do with abandonware when the company has
> collapsed and the
>  *>authors have all died?
>
> The Copyright Act stipulates that it falls to the heirs of
> the owner.
>
> I'll refer you to:
>
> http://lcweb.loc.gov/copyright/title17/

This just show how well suited the copy right law are for books, and yet so
completely unsuitable for digital media. Books can easily sell for 120+
years, but I know of no software company that wants to sell a piece of
software for the lifetime of the company + 70 years!!!! The laws need to be
adjusted to accomodate the new medium.