Re: //e, //c, //gs Questions

[supertimer@aol.com (Supertimer)]

Maynard Lilac <texicus@hotmail.com> wrote:

>I recently bought a number of Apple computers, monitors and disk drives.
>I have an Apple //e, a //c and a //gs. I also have 4 different monitors.
>One is a 9 inch monochrome model that came with the //c. Another is
>called an Apple Monitor ///. Another is simply called an Apple Monitor
>and came with the //e. The last one came with the //gs and seems like a
>slightly smaller version of the standard Mac 13 inch RGB monitor. I also
>have an assortment of external drives, both 5.25 and 3.5 inch. I'd like
>to ask a bunch of questions about these systems if I may.
>
>Operating Systems:
>
>What operating systems will run on these 3 Apples? I had a //+ back in
>the early 80s and can recall certain programs written in BASIC running
>without loading any operating system. I still have a lot of my old
>programs and games for the //+ and was curious if these would work with
>the //e, the //c and the //gs. Can the //c and //gs use some Mac OSs?

Only the IIGS can run a graphical OS somewhat similar to MacOS.
The IIGS' OS can, with the proper software, generate printed
pages on high resolution ink-jet printers and laser printers
with TrueType fonts, an Apple (same as Mac) style GUI, and the
use of the same keyboards and mice as the Mac (in fact, ADB
was first used in the IIGS before being used on Macs...pre-GS
Macs used "telephone" style keyboard cables).

As for whether these IIs can run your old II+ games, the answer
is YES.  Each more advanced II can run software from previous
IIs.  This is just like how even the most advanced Pentium II
can run software for the oldest IBM PC.

Operating systems:

Apple II+ can run DOS 3.3 and up to ProDOS 1.0.1.  You probably
used DOS 3.3 on your old II+.  ProDOS was an improvement in
that it improved speed of disk accesses, supported larger disk
storage devices like 3.5" drives and hard drives, and supported
the concept of subdirectories (folders).

The Apple IIe could run all the operating systems of the II+,
but with the 128k that it normally shipped with plus its
improved capabilities, the IIe can run ProDOS up to ProDOS 8
version 2.0.4, the latest version.  It could also run GEOS,
a modular graphical interface operating system that supports
advanced capabilities such as Postscript fonts and printer
support.  It could also use CP/M with a coprocessor card for
running old Kaypro/Osborn and other pre-MSDOS business
software (did you know that dBase and WordPerfect were
around before the IBM PC?).  It could also run MS-DOS and
an early version of Windows with a coprocessor card called
the PC Transporter.

The Apple IIc ran exactly the same operating systems as the
IIe, minus MS-DOS/early Windows because there was not a
non-slot based version of the coprocessor.  There was one
for CP/M, however.

The Apple IIGS is the computer that can run a Mac-like
operating system, called GS/OS.  If you know how to use
MacOS, you will know how to use GS/OS.  Current GS/OS
kind of resembles System 6 for the Mac, but it has many
Mac System 7 and later features such as keyboard
navigation, System folder routing, all files including
fonts remain as separate files (no "System File" that
grows in size and no Font/DA mover).  In addition, you
can add cooperative multitasking (such as what you get
with current MacOS) with an extension called The Manager.
You can even add preemtive multitasking (like the Amiga's
OS) with a FREE extension called GNO/ME.  As with other
IIs in the II series, the IIGS can run all the less
advanced OSs of its pedecessors.

>System Expansion:
>
>Are expansion cards interchangable between the //+, //e and //gs? Can
>the //c be expanded at all? What type of cards are used with these
>computers (like ISA for PCs and NuBus for Macs)? Can any of these
>systems use hard drives? Which of these systems allow memory expansion?

ALL of these Apple IIs can use hard drives.  However,
it would be quite hard to find one that works in the
II+ these days.

For the Apple IIe and IIGS, you can have a hard
drive for $59.  This will include the latest operating
system for your model (specify when ordering) and
a shareware/freeware library.  For a little more,
you can buy a controller card for using SCSI hard
drives.  The IIGS' OS can use larger hard drives
(it supports HFS, same as Mac).  I've used 1GB
hard drives on a IIGS, no problem!  For the $59
hard drive (an IDE drive) which requires no additional
controller, http://www.allelec.com/ Alltech
Electronics sells "Focus Hard Drive."  Check it
out!

The cards use a standard called "Apple Bus" which has
a transfer limit of 1MB per second.

All Apple IIs use Apple Bus cards, but the cards are
NOT freely interchangeable.  For most cards, you can
take from an older Apple II to a newer one.  An Epson
parallel card will work on a II+ and a IIGS.  But in
many cases, you CANNOT take a card from a newer
Apple II to an older one.  For example, the Visionary
GS 12-bit frame grabber or the Apple II Video Overlay
(genlock) card can work in the IIGS, but cannot work
in the II+.

>Monitors:
>
>All these computers have a video port on the back which seems to be a
>simple RCA port for monochrome video. The //c and //gs have an
>additional 15 pin Mac-like video port. I only have one monochrome video
>cable and was wondering if I could use standard RCA video cabling to
>connect my various monitors to these computers. Can the //c and //gs,
>since they have the Mac-like RGB port, use Mac monitors? Can the
>smallish RGB monitor which came with the //gs be used on a Mac?

The IIc does not have an RGB port, even though it
looks like one.  You must have a separate controller
box hooked up to it for RGB to work on the IIc.

The IIGS has built in support for 15Khz analog RGB
color.  The IIGS itself has a 4096 color palette
and is capable of theoretically throwing up to
3200 of those on screen at once.  The monitor the
IIGS uses will also work on the Amiga and Atari ST
and their monitors will work on the IIGS.

The IIGS CAN use Mac monitors, but NOT through the
built in port (that one is for IIGS, Amiga, Atari ST
monitors).  It needs an Apple BUS SVGA card called
the Second Sight.  Read about it at
http://www.sequential.com/ Sequential Systems.  It
basically provides 24-bit color and 1024x768
capability to the IIGS and output to Macintosh and
Windows PC monitors.

The IIc can't use Mac monitors.

The Mac can use the IIGS monitor provided you add
a converter box called the AverKey.  This converts
the output to 15Khz RGB and NTSC (or PAL) and S-video
for display on televisions and large screen
presentation monitors.  It is because some of
these presentation monitors use the same 15Khz
RGB standard (sometimes called "TV RGB") that the
IIGS, Amiga, and Atari ST uses, that the IIGS monitor
is compatible with the AverKey.

>Requisitioning:
>
>Where would I be able to find various Apple components and old programs
>and OSs for these Apple computers? I've seen a couple web sites which
>have some older Apple // stuff for sale, but they seemed very expensive.
>Also, if anyone could point me to some good Apple // web sites which
>offer nearly endless amounts of info on these systems I would be very
>grateful.

Try http://www.allelec.com/ Alltech Electronics.
Also, although they don't list it, they also
sell a 0-8MB RAM card called the Sirius (call
them to ask, telephone is on web site).  This
card takes 1MB 30pin SIMMs, easy and cheap to
find.  You'll want 4MB to 8MB for the IIGS.
4MB should be your minimum to do useful stuff
like play Wolfenstein 3D (you know, the one that
looks like Doom).  The IIGS version of the game
is free, by the way.  ;-)

>Thanks for taking the time to read my many questions.
>
>
>Maynard

Happy GS computing (pack the other IIs in the
closet for safe keeping)!