Re: Nathan vs Rubywand: Choose sides?

[pfg@cs.rmit.edu.au (Paul Francis Gilbert)]

cplater@rattlehead.accs.wayne.edu (Charles A. Plater) writes:

>Supertimer (supertimer@aol.com) wrote:
>: Since Dr. Tom disapeared, the trash has halved, but THAT OTHER
>: ASSHOLE is still here (and that's NOT Rubywand).

>I'm not so sure about that.

Well I for one am.

>: When someone is dancing around, acting like a jerk, and attacking
>: everyone who tries to enjoy the Apple II (I am NOT a pirate), then
>: you end up with shit like this.

>Can you please explain to me why it is that you take issue with Nate for
>standing up for Apple II programmers?  If you check on GEnie/Dephi and

Maybe because he's an arsehole. ;-) Seriously, maybe it's because he:
1) Consistantly accuses people of piracy without proof

2) Practices character defamanation on a regular basis (and there's a big
   difference between flaming and character defamanation). Let's face it...
   TurkeyShoot is not just a flame attempt, it's a deliberate and
   calculated attempt at character defamation.

3) Seems to be consitutionally incapable of making a post without calling
   someone a dickhead, druggie, pirate, or other flame material.

4) He's been instrumental in driving of several serious Apple // developers
   before of the sheer number of flame threads he's started, and that's
   been documented (despite his whinings that it's all Dr Tom's fault, or
   it's all Rubywand's fault, or it's all the fault of the person I've
   picked randomly to hate this week)

5) He claims copyright on his FAQs, yet copies information from copyrighted
   Apple manuals (not certain about it, but if true what does that say about
   his character? ;-))

6) He's not above mailing ISPs and rootmasters, giving them the same sort
   of false information he regularly dishes out into the newsgroup in an
   attempt to get users accounts suspended, then complains when they aren't

7) He regularly complains about things in the newsgroup publically that should
   be kept in private email. In fact, I'm surprised that he did in fact send
   the email that started this thread privately...

8)  he tends to just shout out accusations without proof consistantly,
   presumably in the belief that if he tells a lie often enough, people will
   start believing him just to get him to shut up. After all, he's spent all
   this time making himself out be a dickhead, whether or not this is 
   actually the case ;-) [but I'm inclinded to believe it's the truth ;-)]

9) He deliberately lies or tells half-truth. Presumably he believes he's
   morally allowed to: the end justifying the means and all that. That sort
   of ties in to 3) a bit.

10) The number of useless flame threads he's started over time, and that
   includes jumping onto other threads and posting inflammatory flame
   material.

>the like you will see that Nate is a respected programmer, who contributes

Hah hah hah hah hah hah. ROTFLOL. hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah.
hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah
hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah
hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah
hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah hah 

Good one. ;-). It's a pity that I think you're actually being serious. I
can't remember the last time I heard the words "Nate" and "respected" in
the same sentence.

>to the Apple II scene.  He's only one of a few left.  The whole point of

Man on man, if Nathan's considered respected, the Apple // scene has 
degraded more than I thought.

>what you call his rants is that if you want to support people like him,
>then don't rally behind known pirates like Dr. Tom.  What did his camp

What you seem to miss is the fact that there's a difference between being
against piracy and actively defaming, flaming, and spamming a newsgroup.
I'll be honest here: If Nutball never flamed, never defamed, and was
cooly rational in pointing out that Dr. Tom, Rubywand, etc. were engaged
in piracy, I'd be more inclined to listen to him.

I don't like piracy (although I agree that there's a huge difference between
copying out-of-date software that's not available anymore and software
that's still being marketed). However, when he engages in such illegal
activities himself (and believe you, *defamanation* IS ILLEGAL), then can
you honestly expect us to believe him?

>ever give us?  4D sound HAHAHA, WPGS (Do we have proof)?  What tangible
>evidence to we have?  Well Nate has given us Twilight II (soon),

Let's be honest... I consider myself a pretty hot-dog Apple // programmer,
but I've never released any of my software publically. Does that therefore
make me any the less of a programmer than someone who released half-assed
stupid programs. I personally don't think so. [Maybe one day I'll release
my "Tower of Trapdoors" or the "Ozone Offense" quiz programs ;-)].

>TurkeyShootGS, GUPP, and quite a few other niceties that he wrot himself.

TurkeyShootGS just proves that 1) releasing half-assed programs doesn't
necessarily make you a good programmer, and 2) proves defamanation against
Dr. Tom (which once again is different to flaming and IS ILLEGAL).

>I know for a fact that Nate has spent quite a lot of time tracking down
>bugs in System 6 to update GUPP so that all of our GSs are more stable.
>As far as I can see, something drastic needed to be done, and as far 
>as I can see, it's still not over.

Doesn't that give you a warm fuzzy feeling inside. Pitty he spent so much
time trying to defend the Wolf3D team about the bug. Hey, if they knew
about it beforehand, didn't bother to fix it, and didn't bother to tell us
about it, then it's a bug with their game as well as the system.

I'll be honest here though: these days I spent more time here than in 
rec.humor.funny... I just love seeing the new crusades Nutball going to
go on next, or what flame he'll try to start.

Does that answer all your questions?

--
Paul Gilbert           | pfg@yallara.cs.rmit.edu.au (The DreamMaster)
Bach App Sci, Bach Eng | The opinions expressed are my own, all my own, and
Year 5, RMIT Melbourne | as such will contain no references to small furry
Australia	       | creatures from Alpha Centauri.