Re: FORWARDING: Message from Steve Buggie

[john1970@iamerica.net]

On 1997-12-17 ericlob@cris.com(ericlob) said:
   First, I'd like to say lately, I see what everyone means.... The
   apple newsgroup is nothing but flames and fighting... I'm new to
   apple and this newsgroup, and can't see how anyone is expected to
   learn anything from this newsgroup expect perhaps how to use Karate
   to kill your neighbor and mother-in-law for snoring too loud....
   Perhaps someone would like to visit the comp.sys.ibm.pc newsgroup
   and see how the children there behave....

   >>Steve Buggie [indirectly] writes:
   >>>        Note the memo that follows from the Computer Boss of our
   >>>branch campus.  The message decrees, "IBM ONLY."
   And this proves??? The only theory I can see for this is that I
   wouldn't want to buy a network from this company for my computer
   system.  No big deal, but the company designing the network is just
   cutting their own throats (similiar to how Apple does in their
   marketing by not encouraging other vendors to develop operating
   systems, etc. for the Apple, and using Non-standard modems in some of
   their earlier computers... (I rember a friend with an early MAC that
   had to buy a special cable to use a Hayes brand modem... Why? The
   RS-232 interface works fine for DEC, IBM, Tandy, etc. why re-invent
   the wheel?)

   >What kind of network are they running that you can't connect to
   >with your Mac?
   Good question, I want to know so I don't recommend it to someone by
   mistake....

   >>Well, no offense intended, but I think you're off base here.
   >>First, I doubt that you have any "rights" when it comes to
   >computers. Yeah, you have the "right" to go pick up compatible gear
   Let's not forget that Apple made plenty of cards for their computers
   that add a standard 25-pin Serial port, and made a 5-pin port
   converter for the IIc/IIe to allow it to handle the standard port.
   The case of the 5-pin port is no big deal (providing companies
   continue to make the 5-pin DIN plugs...) since the cable is a piece
   of cake to make, and for Apple->Apple connections, the 5-pin din is
   at times easier to connect than a 25pin connector (plus with the
   25pin, you have to look-up which wires *NEED* to be connected, or buy
   25-wire cables (which let's just say that 9-wire cables are expensive
   enough!) Where as the 5-pin adapter I'm pretty sure its safe to
   assume you NEED all 5 pins connected on both ends... Ground, Send,
   Receive, Carrier Detect, DTR or CTS (or a combo of the two sorta...)
   means you can't leave too many wires off (yes I have not looked at
   the pin-out of the 5-pin adapter yet, so I may be wrong on the last 2
   pins... I'm just assuming a modem / null-modem would want a Carrier
   Detect...)

   >I think people have responsibilities, but any blind devotion should
   >be checked at the door. I suppose that's semantics though.
   I agree with the blind devotion, but unfortiantly, Responsibilities,
   Duties and "Rights" are all tied in to each other... Rember back in
   Civics class, you probably said "I have the right to freedom of
   speech, why did that cop tell me to turn down the music, or that I
   couldn't cuss out the principle???"  Then he'd reply "Because I also
   have the right to not have to listen to that trash, and your 'Rights'
   are infringing upon my rights, which is where the law draws the
   line..."  Sound familiar? Sure, we have duties as creative hackers to
   help other hackers, but on the same lines, we have rights to not get
   used and abused by other hackers, etc.  We have duties to defend the
   name of our favorite software, but we also have the right to not have
   to defend something that isn't worth the trash we throw away!
   Likewise, we have the right to say "My computer's better than your
   computer" and they have the right to say "No it isn't"  But
   understand that while you have the right to believe your computer is
   best, they are not some kind of mutant from another planet, and in
   fact are a human being just like yourself, and as such, they have the
   same rights that you have (can we say in-alienable rights?) that
   gives them the right to say darn near anything you say.... In fact,
   you can go around and say "My name is Joe, I like sheep", then
   someone could come right behind you and say "My name is Joe, I like
   sheep" and you wouldn't have much to say... Because as far as you
   know, Joe's his nick-name and you can't prove that he doesn't like
   sheep....

   >>Alternately, learn how to maintain your Mac yourself and don't
   >>depend on your techsup people other than to provide IP routing et
     IS this BAD???  When I ran OS/2, I setup pages on the web to help
     others, what's wrong with this?  It's cheaper than calling
     Macintosh and saying "Help, I forgot how to format a disk, can you
     mail me a disk pre-formatted??? Please?  Pretty please???" etc.

   >>al.  If it doesn't require extra work and more knowledge than they
   >>seem to have, I suspect that they will be happy to "support" it,
   >>if only due to potential political ramifications.
   I have no problems with companies that understand that it IS POSSIBLE
   to connect to the internet with something besides a MAC, and
   windows'95... What I do have problems with is if I tell them I have
   an IBM Compatible running DOS only and will be using my own software
   to connect on the internet, then they tell me it doesn't work.... If
   I then ask them are you using any networking software that's any
   different from any of the other internet providers, or are you just
   not providing a true TCP/IP connection to the internet? Then insist
   that its a TCP/IP connection, but will not work with DOS... Funny,
   Net Tamer does a nice job in DOS... Better than Windows95! A
   Commodore64 had Internet packages for it as well... But many
   providers would say its Physically impossible... I'd love to place
   bets with those companies... Say "If I can login to your service with
   a commodore 64, will you give me 1 year free internet service?"
   Be the cheapest 1-yr internet service I ever saw....

   >If your Mac can coexist peacefully on their network then I doubt
   >they'd trace you down and make you stop.
   Try maas.net ... They'll try to... not for MAC or IBM, but... They
   swore up and down that it was impossible for me to run a Telnet'able
   BBS from my dial-up PPP connection.... I mainly wanted it for a few
   friends, but low and behold they said it was impossible because their
   software would not allow that much information to flow through the
   dialup line.... (yeah right, guess he didn't go to internet-101
   before he became the system administrator....) Another reason to not
   use what the internet providers recommend.... Microsoft's got this
   little bug that can crash your computer if someone sends an
   "Out-of-Bounds" message to your computer.... Similiarly, Netscape is
   notorously known for their newer browsers to crash (yet many
   providers act like you can't connect to the internet without
   Netscrape) With software that others don't know too much about (eg.
   the Internet package for Commodore, Net Tamer, etc.) no one knows a
   lot about it, so they can't find "BUGS" and glitches to crash your
   system as easily... Plus, its usually developped by smaller teams,
   which means less chances of one of the developers wanting to "Screw
   the company" and impliment a back-door or even put a virus into a
   portion of their software....  Anyone ever see that camera inside
   Netscape's office... There's a lot of programmers there to worry
   about getting "Angry" - imagine they get a letter "we're laying off
   200 employees at the end of the month..." Think they're going to say
   "Oh yeah, nice working with you, while we're at it, I just finished
   this code, no problem... Good luck with the next release..." Some
   might say that... Others might say "I gotta set the timer on my
   Virus, to enable it next month...."


Johnny@cyberdude.com

Net-Tamer V 1.10.1  - Registered