Re: I'm at a loss for words

[cplater@rattlehead.pass.wayne.edu (Charles A. Plater)]

Steve Mentzer (smentzer@pacbell.net) wrote:
: #1 - If you would take a good long look at the actions of Nathan Mates, you 
:      will see that he has made a habit of being a very condescending
:      and arrogant individual who does not accept any other view than his
:      own. I have seen him lambast several individuals for merely expressing
:      their opinion or ask a question, which may be legally objectionable.

I have considered Nathan as a friend since way before this whole Dr. Tom
Vs. Nathan Mates thing ever started.  Keep in mind that there are more
people than Nathan who have a problem with Mr. Turley.  I do believe that
Joe Kohn has a restraining order out on Dr. Tom becuase of harassment
(This it the way that I remembered the story, at the very least Joe has
had to call the police to report harassment by Dr. Tom.)

: #2 - It seems to me that Nathan Mates is "drawing a line" between himself 
:      and anyone who does not follow his values and morals regarding the
:      distribution of software. Even in the Apple II's heyday, I have never
:      seen such contempt for people that Nathan Mates has shown. He has
:      proven over and over again that he is right and everyone else is wrong..
:      Or has he?

Well I guess if you disagree with him and see piracy as being OK, then you
would see his actions this way.  Nathan has released some very good
programs.  One that comes to mind is Swatter Disk which I don't think he
even recieved 2 shareware payments for.  He might just be a little bitter
about that.

: #3 - It is a shame that you are leaving. It is a shame that you feel compelled
:      to pick sides. Charles Turley has not asked you to do so. It is nathan
:      mates who prefers to admonish those who will not follow him. 


: The bottom line is that Nathan Mates is trying to play "god" over a small
: but dedicated legion of Apple II users and fanatics. It is unfortunate that
: he has made it his pet project to attempt to regulate and control what people
: can and cannot get from places such as the asimov archive. 

The bottom line is that Nathan is trustworth, and as far as I'm concerned,
Dr Tom is not.


: If he does not believe in piracy, then fine. I dont agree with piracy either, 
: but this is not 1985 and the Apple II has long since been dead. The only thing
: any of us have left is our ability to use software that we once loved and
: adored.

People seem to think that piracy did not kill the Apple II.  Well you are
wrong.  The problem with Apple II piracy was that the Apple II market was
not big enough.  Just about everyone pirated every software that came out.
If the user base had been twice the size with 1/2 of them purchasing the
software things would have been ok, and the IIgs might still be alive
today, but piracy ended this.

: The only other way to get the majority of this software is to buy it 
: second hand from some person selling it across the "net", or to purchase
: it from some of these "land shark" apple II dealers of software. Often
: times, these people want almost as much for the software as it was 
: 5 years ago. Highway robbery I call it. 

This is true, but what about the PacMac disk that Dr. Tom had up on his
web page that included the version of PacMac that Joe Kohn was selling for
$8.00.   I don't consider that price Highway robery.

: Face it, when we copy AppleWorks 3.0, its not like making CD duplicates
: of windows NT. You have a valid argument. I never denied that.

: But comparing the piracy of old apple II software to the piracy of today
: should not be a moral issue. And if you rely on legal premise, then
: I can only ask that you look to the constitution of the united states of
: america. There are several items in the constitution that were "great
: when it was written, but dont apply to 90's society". So true is the
: case of apple II piracy. Your moral and legal argument are valid, but
: may not apply in the context of our current dilemna..



--

        Charles A. Plater, Lab Supervisor, Wayne State University

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