Re: Resurrecting the Apple I

["Liam Busey" <buseyl@yahoo.com>]

"Michael Black" <et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA> wrote in message
news:asmkb5$irr$1@freenet9.carleton.ca...
> "Liam Busey" (buseyl@yahoo.com) writes:
> > "Bryan Villados" <news002@macgeek.org> wrote in message
> > news:WHfH9.67688$2z1.23482029@twister.socal.rr.com...
> >> Here's something I don't know to this day... Does the Apple 1 have any
> > form
> >> of BASIC? Or does it just run 6502 machine language apps? I'm wondering
> >> because if the Apple 1 can run stuff the Apple II cannot, then yeah the
> >> Apple 1 would be cool to play with. However, if everything written for
an
> >> Apple 1 can run on an Apple II, then why bother?
> >>
> >> The only thing I can see getting out of an Apple 1 would be playing
with
> > the
> >> experimental breadboard that was built into it. And, by the looks of
the
> >> clone Apple 1, it lacks it. Also, what's disappointing about the clone
> > Apple
> >> 1 is that all the components seemed to be shrunken down to just a few
> > modern
> >> chips. The complexity of the Apple 1 in terms of its PCB layout and the
> > many
> >> chips on it was something to admire over, especially those huge
> > capacitors.
> >> The clone Apple 1 is lacking that visual effect. I keep reading article
> >> after article about how hardware junkies admire how Steve Wozniak laid
out
> >> the PCB and made it pretty, versus slapping components all over the
place
> >> like your average Wintel-based motherboard.
> >>
> >> If this guy's going to clone something, why not use his knowledge and
> > clone
> >> an Apple IIe? Make a very tiny form factored Apple IIe, maybe the size
of
> > an
> >> Apple 5.25 Drive case, with built-in peripherals (clock, RAM, 80-column
> >> video, mouse port, disk port, serial and printer ports) that would
> > simulate
> >> having them occupy slots. And, make it work with a PS/2 keyboard,
mouse,
> > and
> >> VGA output so someone like myself could use a PC-compatible KVM
switchbox.
> >> You could buy a IIe logic board for 50-cents, pull the Apple licensed
ROMs
> >> off of it and use it in the clone IIe so you don't have to pay Apple a
> >> licensing fee. End of licensing discussion. I don't think software
> > emulation
> >> solves EVERYTHING... There's still a taste for hardware-based Apple
IIs.
> >>
> >
> > It's pretty mystifying to me that Apple I computers  command so much
money.
> > I guess value is in the eye of the beholder. In my opinnion it was the
> > original Apple 2 that was the real innovation. Sure the Apple I was a
clever
> > piece of hardware but still it was basically just a SBC with integrated
TV
> > typewriter. If people weren't so crazy about Apple computer, I suspect
those
> > machine's average asking price would be more in line with the likes of
MOS
> > KIMs or Rockwell AIMs.
> >
> > Does anyone share this opinion?
> >
> I doubt many will share your opinion.
>
> The difference is that the Apple I was made in very limited quantities.
> "Fire in the Valley" says "200 or so".
>
> When you subtract those that were trashed, because it was a relatively
> primitive computer and better things came along not much later, and
> those discared because people didn't realize it was an important computer,
> that doesn't leave very many.  Of those remaining, there will be original
> or long term owners who won't part with theirs.  Leaving very few that
> are available to change hands.
>
> There were a lot more KIM-1's made (I've had one since 1979 and the
> magazines were full of articles about them, unlike the Apple I),
> and I think the Aim-65 too.  They don't have the initial rarity
> of the Apple I, and no, they probably don't carry as much lust-factor
> as the Apple I.
>
> Later Apple computers are plentiful.  I once briefly had a III, for
> free, and have a real II and a IIGS (both freebies).  If I was collecting,
> I could easily have bought a IIC or two, and probably a IIE if I'd
> felt the need for one (once I had the II, I stopped paying attention other
> than to note that I see Apple II's at rummage and garage sales).  I have
> a 512K Mac, and didn't bother keeping my Mac Plus when I realized the
> screen was fading out.
>

I suppose I'm looking at this from a different angle. I've got quite a few
moldy computers myself but I wouldn't keep them if I couldn't play with
...errr use them. I can't imagine an Apple I being anything but a wall
hanger in this day in age. Do you think there would be an interest in a
faithful Apple I clone? If you remove the afore mentioned
scarcity/historical value do you believe the Apple I design is interesting
enough to hack on?

- Liam Busey