Re: The "user-developer gap" myth

[Roy and/or Janet Miller <millers@inetnebr.com>]

Rubywand wrote:

> > The Apple II users on Delphi are still a close knit bunch and are
> > always happy to welcome more people.
>  ....
>
>      Thanks to a long, sorry record of user abuse-- personal attacks, deleted
> messages, lockouts, etc.

Messages that are personally abusive or that give notice of where to find
software and other copyrighted materials that have not been verified as being
released for free distribution, yes, messages like that are erased, and people
who are abusive of others, like what is seen in this post, are made to feel
unwelcome, or even "locked out". Civil discourse is enforced there.

> -- three of the Apple II forums on Delphi do not even
> mention the two forums you're promoting.

Well, since Jeff Blakeney is referring to two forums, and Rubywand claims that
there are three that don't mention the two that jeff is discussing, that means
five Apple ][ forums on Delphi, but I've only found four (unless you include the
6502 forum) The other two are controlled by DrTom and Rubywand, have very few
posts other than those made by DrTom and Rubywand, and very light traffic (I
know, I check all four.) Rubywand says above, without mentioning that he and
DrTom control those two forums, that they don't mention the A2 and A2Pro forums,
which have many posts, many visitors, and even active chat rooms. I wonder why?
Why don't they mention forums that have heavy traffic when they have little or
none? Why didn't he mention that he and his good buddy control those forums?

> I've lost count of the number of
> posted and emailed complaints; but, at some point, one just has to say
> 'enough is enough'. Sending any enthusiastic new Apple II user to such places
> is a disservice.

But many new, enthusiastic Apple ][ users do go there, and are made to feel
welcome and given help, except for help to find copyrighted materials that have
not been released for free distribution. I was one, there are several others here
that have similar experiences.

>      Probably, given the "close knit" nature of the clique which runs the two
> forums, there is no way to boot the bozos responsible for killing them
> (pretty much the same way they have bombed KFest). If you can't dump the
> dopes, your best bet for running a successful Apple II Programmers' forum on
> Delphi is to start your own and make sure the screwups do not get Assistant
> status.

But Rubywand's forum isn't very successful, and he's followed that formula, as
least in his own light.

bobryan, please note the "restraint" and "respectful" language used to refer to
Jeff Blakeney, Eric Shepherd, Joe Kohn, et al. Do you see why some "vogons" (more
"respectful" speech - right?) respond with similar or even worse retorts. This
kind of personal abuse has gone on for years, and has driven a number of people,
not out of csa2, but out of the Apple ][ community.

Roy