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Re: School Has Started
Tero Sand (cust_ts@cc.Helsinki.FI) wrote:
: In article <36kh45$qtc@eis.calstate.edu>,
: Greg R. Achenbach <gachenb@eis.calstate.edu> wrote:
: >This is an issue of ACCESS.
: >Whether you or your peers consider something acceptable is
: >immaterial. What it comes down to is whether the teacher of those
: >kids (or more likely the parents) thinks it is appropriate on not.
: >It's not the kids we are worried about, it's the teachers. If they
: >think it is inappropriate, or are told it is inappropriate by parents
: >or supervisors, they may very well limit or eliminate access to the
: >'net for their students. Whether you like this or not, it is
: >reality. Come on! Is your use of profanity so important to you that
: >you are willing to compromise the educational value of the net? This
: >is not about censorship! This is about how we can best acheive the
: >goals that most of us share relative to moving our society more fully
: >into the world of telecommunications (and using Apple II's to do it).
: So, keep bringing up that opinion. That is all you should have the right
: to do. This all started, on my part, when Joe made threats of further
: actions (paraphrase).
: >An analogy was made in this thread between the 'net and a bar. Oh,
: >great! That will really help our students get proficient with
: >telecommunications. "Uh, excuse me Mister District Superintendant,
: >we think your student would benefit greatly by having a bar in every
: >one of your classrooms." Get real, Tero.
: No, _you_ get real. That is how Usenet _is_, as far as unmoderated
: usegroups are concerned.
: > A classroom is not a bar!
: No, but Usenet is. Deal with it. This is terribly blunt, but it seems to
: me you're trying to present Usenet as something it isn't. _This_ is the
: dangerous approach, since it can be shot down oh so easily.
: >If you want UseNet newsgroups to have only such speech restrictions
: It has absolutely nothing to do with what I want. It's what it is. The
: only way to change this wrt c.s.a2 is to get it moderated, and you have
: far _less_ chance in succeeding there than a snowball in hell.
I like a profanity-free environment, but I HATE newsgroup moderation,
for two reasons: 1. The moderator can suppress any views he or she
does not like and 2. Moderation is very slow. When I post an article,
I want it up there immediately!
: >as would be appropriate in a bar, you are basically saying that
: >UseNet newsgroups don't belong in the classroom.
: If a profanity-clear environment is what parents or teachers want, then
: yes, so it is. To be frank, they should then also lock their kids in a
: closet, but that's another issue.
: I have been
: >impressed with the quality of your informative posts to this group in
: >the past, but you are way out to lunch with this analogy.
: No, you are. Usenet News is not "news." Maybe it was some 20 odd years
: ago, but it sure ain't anymore.
: >Let me repeat, the issue is NOT the appropriateness or legality of
: >certain language. The issue IS access to this group, and to the net
: >at large, by students.
: Let me get this straight. If somebody, let's say <z>, has a hostage they
: are threatening to kill if <x> doesn't do <y>, and <x> doesn't, and <z>
: kills the hostage, <x> is to blame? Point being, if teachers or parent's
: limit access to the net, it is they who are doing the disservice to the
: kids.
: Finally, let me once again say this started on my part when Joe made
: some vague threats. I still say, voice your opinion, anything further
: (re profanity) _is_ net.facsism.
: Well, one more note. Once kids learn how to access Usenet, just about
: nobody will remain limited to the apple2 groups. So, frankly, cleaning
: up c.s.a2 is a waste of time, if your motivation is to shield kids of
: profanity.
: Which I happen to think is a waste of time anyway, but I digress.
: >Greg Achenbach gachenb@eis.calstate.edu (soon to be ctp.org)
: --
: Tero Sand, 2 kyu (4k*) ! "We have become... the stewards of life's
: ! continuity on Earth. We did not ask for this
: EMail: cust_ts@cc.helsinki.fi ! role, but we cannot abjure it. We may not be
: custts@cc.helsinki.fi ! suited for it, but here we are." -S.J. Gould
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