Re: Mouse using graphics programs?

["Mark Cummings" <NOTfigjams@primus.com.au>]

> >> Don't think it's that simple... I have a //c mouse that doesn't work
> >> on my //c, but my IIe mouse does. Both work on the IIe and Mac Plus.
> >> Whether it matters or not I don't know, but if you look at the model
> >> number of the mouse some start with "A2" and some with "M" --
> >> presumably this would indicate Apple 2 or Macintosh. I've always
> >> suspected the problem (in my case) is with the mouse port on the //c...
> >> since it doubles as the game port maybe there's bug.
> > Possibly ones with an A2 number will work but I also
> > was under the distinct impression that since the IIc's
> > game port doubles as a mouse port that the mouses
> > were wired differently. All I know for sure is that all
> > the M0100 mouses I have don't work and all the ones
> > marked IIe don't work and all the ones with IIc on the
> > label do work. So, IMHO, if you get one that is marked
> > IIc you run a better risk of it working. I also read about
> > a hack where you add a resistor or diode, can't remember
> > which now to the IIc motherboard and it allows either
> > one to work. There is also a paddle thing you can do, but
> > I'm not so sure I would mess with that. ;-) I now have 2
> > IIc mouses that work, and 3 IIc's so I'm looking for one
> > more. Very little I need now but much more WANTS.
> On a Mac's mouse socket pins 1 and 3 are labelled as ground, and I
> assume the Apple mouse card is the same. On the IIc mouse/joystick
> connector pin 1 is used for Mouse ID (mouse) or pushbutton 1 (joystick)
> and pin 3 only is ground.
> On the third-party mouse I have pin 1 is connected directly to pin 3.
> This mouse works with my IIc, and is advertised to work with a Mac and
> Apple II mouse card as well. So it would seem for the IIc to work with a
> mouse, the mouse has to pull pin 1 directly to ground. I suspect that
> the early mice didn't have this link, and it was only added after the
> Apple IIc was released.
> A quick test with an ohmeter will verify if pins 1 and 3 are connected
> in the plugs of the mice you have that don't work, versus the ones that
> do work.
> From Rubywand's FAQs:
> What is the pinout for the IIe, //c, Laser and similar 9-pin mouses?
> The IIe/IIc/Mac Plus mouses can plug into the //c or IIc+ Game/Mouse
> Port or,
> on a IIe, into the 9-pin socket of a Mouse Card. When plugged into the //
> c or
> IIc+, several Game Port pins are redefined for use with a mouse.
> Dsub-9 Female Socket on Computer Dsub-9 Male Plug on Mouse
> ,---------------------. ,---------------------.
> \ 5 4 3 2 1 / \ 1 2 3 4 5 /
> \ 9 8 7 6 / \ 6 7 8 9 /
> `-----------------' `-----------------'
> Mouse Usual //c, IIc+ Game Port Function
> 1 MOUSE ID Pushbutton 1
> 2 +5V +5V
> 3 GND GND
> 4 XDIR no Game Port function on //c, IIc+;
> this TTL-compatible input can be read at $C066
> 5 XMOVE Game Control 0 or PDL0 (Joystick X-axis)
> 6 n.c. (no Game Port function on //c, IIc+)
> 7 MOUSE BUTTON Pushbutton 0
> 8 YDIR Game Control 1 or PDL1 (Joystick Y-axis)
> 9 YMOVE no Game Port function on //c, IIc+;
> this TTL-compatible input can be read at $C067


after reading this thread I realised that I had the same problem with the
lack of vertical mouse control on my //c, in that the cursor ended at the
bottom of the screen and wouldn't move up. not realising that it could have
been the type of Mouse II that was the culprit, I had always thought there
was a problem in the //c.
scrounging through my collection of 5 Mouse IIs, or is that Mice IIs :), I
tried all of them in turn and found that 2 worked and 3 didn't. had I only
known before !, like 12 months ago. oh well now I do :)

as far as which ones worked and those that didn't I found:

- a Beige M0100 made in Japan with a 590-055-A cord did not work,
- 2x Platinum M0100 made in Japan with a 590-055-A cord that did not work,
- a Beige M0100 made in USA with a 590-0320 cord that worked,
- an all Cream (incl button) A2M4015 that worked.

also I tested for continuity between pin 1 and pin 3 on all 5 Mice, and they
were all short circuit.
so I didn't really find anything other than the cord part number that helped
identify those that worked, but I guess 5 is only a small sample.

I would really like to find out what that mod is for the //c that allows any
Mouse II to work, because I'd prefer one of the Platinum Mice were connected
to it to match my //c's Platinum keyboard colour. It's off to RubyWand FAQ
for more research.

I havn't repeated the test on the Mouse II interface card on the //e or the
Mouse Port on my Mac Plus, but I suspect they will all work from reading the
comments of others here.

thanks Roger and Simon and others for this small bit of info that got my //c
going 100%.

Mark