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Re: Modern A2 successor
Arkain,
I think your basic idea is great! I have often thought that computers
today lack that certain something that the Apple 2 and her
contemporaries (C-64, Tandy CoCo, etc.) had. Specifically, today's
computers are glorified toasters, where the original home computers were
more hands-on.
I think the box you've described could in many ways be a worthy
successor to that entire generation of home computers. I do think there
is a market there, even if it is a little small. Please let me know if
I can contribute to this project! :-)
John
Arkain wrote:
>
> Roy and/or Janet Miller <millers@inetnebr.com> wrote in message
> 3980B090.8C44665E@inetnebr.com">news:3980B090.8C44665E@inetnebr.com...
> > Arkain wrote:
> >
> > > You really don't get it do you...
> > > Let me try to explain my theory. Keep reading....
> >
> > :-) perhaps we are talking past one another here, but I suspect that you
> > haven't gotten my point.
>
> I got your point. You see this as being purely a hobyist machine. I see it
> as being a hobyist machine w/ potential practical applications and uses. It
> may even have the possibility of reclaimimg the old A2 market... but that's
> probably just wishful thinking.
>
> > >
> > > Roy and/or Janet Miller <millers@inetnebr.com> wrote in message
> > > 3980A145.83835F80@inetnebr.com">news:3980A145.83835F80@inetnebr.com...
> > > > Arkain wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > ??? What??? Don't you have any imagination? There are only at least
> 10
> > > > > specific things that I could use the slots for...
> > > > >
> > > > > Unlisted posibilities for the slots:
> > > > >
> > > > > 1. Ethernet cards
> > > >
> > > > The problem here of course, is the bus is a tight bottleneck.
> > >
> > > An 8 bit 50Mhz bus can easily handle up to 4 100Mbit cards. A 64bit
> 50Mhz
> > > bus can even deal with up to 3 1Gbit cards. I can't say that I see your
> > > bottleneck just yet.
> >
> > But that *isn't* the Apple II bus. Woz's bus is a 1 mhz 8 bit bus. That's
> the
> > bottleneck. Even on the IIGS, the slots are still 8 bit 1 mhz slots. I'd
> be
> > surprised if you could push it much past 8 mhz. Pleasantly surprised, but
> > surprised none the less.
>
> No. It's not. I said that this new machine would be a "modern" version of
> the older system. With that in mind, I'd need a faster bus. I can always
> create a controller to handle the cards requiring the 1Mhz bus speed.
>
> > > > >
> > > > > 3. Modem cards
> > > >
> > > > Who's gonna make a XTII modem?
> > >
> > > Who cares? Make 14.4, 28.8 or 56K modems, or even faster if you like.
> >
> > I care. Why would you create a slot that will never be filled?
>
> ... because I wouldn't say never since I think it just might....
>
> <snipped>
> > > > >
> > > > > 5. Co-processor cards
> > > >
> > > > Ditto
> > >
> > > Suppose I want to run CP/M?
> >
> > Then you don't need extended slots - or all 7 of the II slots.
>
> You're right there, but I say better safe than sorry. Besides, I'd like to
> see new hardware developed for it.
>
> > >
> > > > >
> > > > > 6. Scsi cards
> > > >
> > > > Ditto
> > >
> > > You must be a Mac user. PC's don't usually come with built-in SCSI
> support,
> > > just as Mac's don't usually come with EIDE-ATA support. I chose EIDE
> over
> > > SCSI for it's low price and relative simplicity.
> >
> > Actually, I use various machines, depending on what I'm doing. But I
> thought
> > you said in the post above that you would put SCSI on the motherboard,
> which is
> > why I wrote "ditto." Perhaps I was wrong, if so ya got me. :-)
>
> I think you misread it.
>
> > >
> > > > > 7. USB cards
> > > > > 8. FireWire cards
> > > >
> > > > Ditto for both - though, I'm so far behind that I really don't know
> what
> > > I'd do
> > > > with either of these :-)
> > >
> > > Most peopple don't use them, but that doen't mean that no one will want
> > > them! Some folks are satisfied just having the option.
> > >
> > > > >
> > > > > 9. Video Capture cards
> > > > > 10. TV Video/S Video out cards
> > > >
> > > > Cool - but PCI cards already exist for these, and who will design and
> > > > manufactor these in the dozens?
> > >
> > > Who cares? That soen't mean that no one will try. After all, it's just
> > > another possibility.
> >
> > Well you see, that's my point. There are so very few hardware projects
> around
> > because there are so few people to sell them to. Like with modems, an
> existing
> > bus (ISA/Microchannel/PCI/Nubus) that has cards I can already buy and use
> (I
> > guess that rules out Microchannel and EISA) would make more sense than an
> > extension to a 23 year old bus. Of course, if you were going to do this
> just
> > for your own pleasure have fun, and I'd love to see it run sometime. But I
> > wouldn't buy such a motherboard, because I sincerely doubt that there
> would
> > ever be cards available to put in the slots. I'd love to be proven wrong
> > though!
>
> But if this project manages to reclaim some reasonable protion of the old A2
> market then the work I will have put in will be justified.
>
> Arkain