Re: Apple GS RGB monitor question, are the leads reversible that connect from the GS to monitor?

[spec@vax2.concordia.ca (Mitchell Spector)]

In article supertimer@aol.com (Supertimer) writes...

>spec@vax2.concordia.ca (Mitchell Spector) wrote:
>
>>    An external hardware device called "JAM!!" already exists that
>>inputs composite video and outputs it to an SVGA frequency display.
>>It is intended for hooking up video game consoles to PC monitors,
>>though should work equally as well with the IIgs. The catch is the
>>composite output from the IIgs is non-standard and makes a mess
>>with color and resolution (unlike say, the Amiga or SuperNintendo).
>>
>>    Still, this device would get Apple II and IIgs video onto any
>>modern VGA/SVGA display, and from what I recall, cost around US$60
>
>Composite video is not good enough.

    It would be fine for a standard 8-bit Apple II. The Apple IIgs
is a different story, anyone who's every connected their system to
a color composite monitor or television set knows the problems all
too well. The output is not at all clean.

    If you have a Video Overlay Card however, then it would work
quite well since that cleans up the IIgs's composite output from
what I hear (probably matching the same standards as the Amiga).

>Even on the Amiga, which has more standard NTSC composite video than the
>IIGS, the color bleading is unacceptable.  Commodore
>monitors usually have composite, TTL, and analog RGB
>inputs.  Amiga users, although they can, never use the
>composite one.  The quality is too bad.

    RGB is preferred obviously, but I've seen an Amiga 500 using
a composite display or TV and the output was very decent. It is
nothing at all like the mess you get with the IIgs, all 4096 of
its colors are distinct and pure, all resolutions modes are can
all be seen.

>>which is third of the cost of a Second Sight card. I don't know
>>the company's URL off hand, though you should be able to find it
>>easily enough searching on Yahoo or Dejanews (I often see ads for
>>it on over on http://www.davesclassics.com).
>
>But the Second Sight actually produces readable text.  ;-)
>
>Really, this JAM! device is not only unacceptable to a
>IIGS user (just try looking at 640 mode or 80 column
>text mode on a TV set), it is also unacceptable to Amiga
>users.

    VGA/SVGA monitors have much higher bandwidth than a TV set.
Chances are it would produce more readable text with composite
converted to SVGA than S-Video to a standard television set.

    Apple IIe/IIc users output composite video all the time to
a monochrome display, yet 80 columns text and monochrome Double
Hi-Res are very sharp and readable. The reason is monochrome
screens support a higher bandwidth than TV sets.

>If you wanted to fool around with something like this,
>why not get a Video Turtle?  This takes the analog
>RGB signal and converts it to S-video.
>
>15Khz analog RGB<-Video Turtle->S-video TV
>
>is superior to
>
>composite video<-JAM!->VGA/SVGA monitor
>
>It is not the monitor, it is the signal.  Composite
>video sucks!

    The Second Sight is obviously the best solution in terms of
picture sharpness (all converting is digital, Apple II graphics
are intercepted and then emulated by the VGA chipset), but it
is also the most costly of the three. Unfortunately it is also
the least accurate too.

    This "JAM!!" product would probably work quite nicely for
someone who already owns a Video Overlay Card though, and
would like to send a _clean_ composite signal to a PC SVGA
or Macintosh RGB display (at least it will be much clearer
than a TV, and you won't have to put up with 60 Hz flicker).
I can't comment on "JAM!!" having never seen or used one,
but here is the URL incase anyone is interested:

http://www.aimslab.com/Products/JAM!!/jamhome.htm

    Before we get into a debate on this, I'll say that I don't
think "JAM!!" is an ideal solution for your average IIgs user.
The only plus is it is affordable. I'm not exactly fond of the
Video Turtle or Second Sight as options either for the record.

Mitchell Spector
spec@vax2.concordia.ca