Re: Unbelievable Auctions

["Henry" <apl2research(.a.t.)comcast.net>]

Hey Sean.

I know what you mean about a 'double edge sword' with cloning something.  I 
think it will effect some prices, but probably not how you think. To 
collectors there's nothing like an original.  Up till now there hasn't been 
any other options for people but originals.  As those options increase with 
cloned ones some prices will fall I would tend to think, but only for a 
time.  People like you and I who don't 'need' to have an original item and 
actually use it won't have to compete with collectors, which probably will 
effect some auction prices.  It also has the potential to draw more people 
in to the hobby, who may also become collectors and drive prices up.  I've 
actually seen that happen with Arcade machines.  Anyone can play Space 
Invaders on their computer, but once the bug bites and you decide to get an 
original Arcade game for your game room, then you don't have much choice but 
to buy an Arcade unit which all comes back to supply and demand.

Take the 2 Meg Plus Expander for the RAMWorks III.  I've yet to see one go 
up for auction on eBay even though I've posted pictures of the prototype and 
even sold a few to people.  If people really thought the market would crash 
with cloned hardware then I would assume we would see everyone dump their 
boards like crazy.  It didn't happen with the Mockingboard's and it probably 
won't happen with other hardware.

Also take the case of the Vulcan or Cider drives.  Since the MicroDrive and 
CFFA options have been available you still see Vulcans and Ciders selling. 
So even with other, even better options available the originals still sell 
and usually for big bucks.  Same holds true for most any nostalgic item. 
Anyone can buy a $5 GI Joe doll, but one from 1950 will always sell for 
more.  Originals always do.

I just see the 'cloning project' will allow the nubies (and us) to have 
their hardware and use it too.  Collectors can also have their hardware (I 
guess under glass?) and also use a cloned item if they wish.  Lets face 
it... 20 year old hardware can't last too much longer in original condition. 
If an IC burns out, then it's not original anymore.

I also must agree about market spikes.  $200 joysticks are a fluke - or a 
bidding mistake.  But really 'rare' items like the Second Site card will go 
for big money and the market will continue to ebb and flow.


-- 
Henry S. Courbis
www.GSE-Reactive.com
Apple II Series Legacy Hardware - Come take a look at what we have to offer!


"Sean Fahey" <a2fan@hotmail.com> wrote in message 
news:C9ypg.125929$dW3.18222@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
> Henry wrote:
>
>> Also to put things in perspective - the average restored 'classic' car 
>> will be about $15k.  The average arcade game, Pinball or Video, will be 
>> about $2500.  So $500 for an Apple IIe or IIgs loaded how you like is 
>> just a drop in the bucket in comparison and probably 100 times less 
>> maintenance.
>>
>> Plus, you guys are just cheap! ;-)
>>
>
> I'm jaded. I scan eBay everyday and roll my eyes when I see "RARE!" on 
> stuff that's as common as dirt. I view each auction through the eyes of 
> both a collector and as a common user.
>
> I monitor items that really are rare and when they go for big bucks, I 
> congratulate the seller and the buyer - the seller for getting a nice 
> payout, the buyer because of their obvious appreciation for something 
> special.
>
> I do feel bad for newbie people (headneck01 isn't a newbie though) who buy 
> things at outlandish prices. Vulcans aren't that rare. An Apple joystick, 
> even a new one isn't $200+ rare. These are anomolies - spikes. Similar 
> items listed mere weeks and months before went for a fraction of the 
> price, on multiple occasions. I guess if the buyers of these items thought 
> the prices were worth it, thats their business - but I think they cause an 
> artificial inflation that effects everyone else.
>
> I have no problems ponying up the money to get something I want within 
> reason. As Doug pointed out, this used to be a cheap(er) hobby to 
> participate in. So, when one of these anomolies hits eBay, it's a dual 
> edge sword for me. On one hand, I'm amazed that the someone would pay that 
> much. Then I reflect on the collection in my office and garage and think, 
> "damn! I need to get a security system!"
>
> Personally, this forces an unwelcome change in my perceptions and values 
> of the hobby. Previously, I had a "one for all, all for one - what comes 
> around, goes around" attitude. I'd give away duplicates of stuff I had 
> collected because others had done the same for me. Now, there is that nag 
> of self-interest in the back of my head. Instead of just sharing, I think 
> "whoa, I might get serious $$$ for that on eBay".
>
> Also, it encourages hoarding - personal example: some of the really rare 
> items I've shared with cloning efforts - if they get cloned, they won't be 
> as rare anymore and therefore won't be worth as much if I wanted to sell 
> them. Take the Ramfactor (not rare, but uncommon) and it's 4MB expansion 
> (extremely rare) - a lot of people would like to own a 5MB slinky, 
> especially since the Ramfactor has partitions and superior DOS, Pascal, 
> etc. compatibility versus the Apple slinky. When GSE-Reactive.com begins 
> selling that clone - my original isn't going to be as rare and unique 
> anymore, and probably not as valuable. Did I do the right thing sharing 
> the card so it could be cloned, or did I screw myself for when I might 
> want to sell it for a nice payout? In the end, I chose to think that it 
> was best for the community.
>
> Eh, I guess it all depends on how material minded we are.
>
> I don't mind buying the new stuff being developed for my old obsolete 
> computer. I love seeing new gear and gadgets for the Apple II.