Re: Apple 2 Where/How much

[supertimer@aol.com (Supertimer)]

labelas@hotmail.com (Labelas Enoreth) wrote:

><sigh>
>Ah well, I tried... 
>
>Supertimer, you have a personal established value for setups that you can
>conceive, whether in concept or ones that you've assembled yourself.
>Whether other people will pay that much or agree with that value is up to
>their own preferences. Someone could very well say 'geez, I don't need all
>that for the IIgs, do you just want to sell it without most of that?'.

That's fine.  I can just sell the IIGS core cheap and sell the
peripherals for more.

Despite what Mitch has been saying, I'm not piling up peripherals
to inflate the price of the IIGS.  I'm just answering ONE statement.
Mitch said he could think of NO IIGS SETUP worth $300+.  I
provided an example.

Look at it this way, assume I were out to sell my IIGS setup.  I
sell it in pieces.  Ok, so if most people would pay more for the
SVGA monitor or the laser printer than the IIGS, so what?  When
after I sold all the peripherals plus the IIGS, how much would I
get for my entire setup?  $300+.

>Personally, as far as I've seen, modern setups like that are generally
>assembled by someone who isn't really planning to sell it, or if they are
>they already have a target in mind.

Absolutely.  It would take a tsunami to separate me from my
kick butt IIGS setup.  ;-)

That still does not change the fact that it EXISTS.  That's all
I was stating.

>When I showed
>resources to purchase a SCSI card and HD, a SuperDrive, an
>accelerator...for my friend's IIgs that he's had since the beginning (and
>they were quite reasonable), he just laughed, remarked something about
>"polishing a turd" and informed me that _any_ money spent towards a
>computer would be towards the eventual day when he got a 'real' computer.
>(he's since gotten a <insert name of random pentium-based w98-running PC
>here> and apparently chucked his IIgs, which saddens me [I would've taken
>it] but hey, that's the way things happen...it's just...life. For a
>'couple hundred dollars', someone can spend towards a 'much better
>computer' in their opinion, why sink so much into a 'dying machine' that's
>not much less than a conversation piece or toy to mess around with every
>once in a while?

Well ok, I have this camera called the Zenit 122k.  It is, believe
it or not, a camera designed in the former Soviet Union.  It
works, but has very little resale value.  The SLR body (equivalent
to the CPU in a computer setup) is worth about $10.  However,
I've added Pentax K-mount compatible autofocus lenses to this
camera.  Now if your friend was a photo person, he would
probably think I was a turd worth polishing.  I mean, why would
someone mount a modern autofocus lens on an old camera body,
right?

The problem with looking at it this way: the lens, like the laser
printer, is what makes the image.  The better the lens, the better
the image.  I don't really care so much about the camera body
as having a good lens to make a good image.

But I'm stupid for sinking money to buy modern lenses for
an old camera, right?  Wrong.  The reason is because the same
lenses that work on my Zenit will also work on the newest
Pentax models.  And you know what, in the future, I can
upgrade the body to a Pentax and I'd have a fully modern
computer setup.

But is my Zenit SETUP, that is, the camera and the lenses,
currently worth $10?  No.  It is worth much more.

Is the Zenit itself worth $10?  Probably.

Just like the Zenit body versus the Zenit setup, a IIGS itself
can be worth little, but the IIGS SETUP can be worth a lot.
And people are not stupid just because they have good IIGS
setups because those peripherals can be used on other
computers.

AND JUST BECAUSE THOSE PERIPHERALS CAN BE
USED ON OTHER COMPUTERS DOES NOT MEAN IT
IS CURRENTLY NOT PART OF THE IIGS SETUP.

>Just because _my_ concept of a good IIgs has a big HD, a nice fast
>accelerator, 8Mb of RAM, the PCT with ColorSwitch, slots packed with tons
>of useful cards...(maybe even a Second Sight with nice big monitor, who
>knows? never even seen one, much less seen one in usage)
>doesn't mean that everyone else with a IIgs would like to have the same
>configuration, or spend the money to have such a setup. They may just want
>to run AWGS 1.1 and maybe Arkanoid every once in a while.

Despite what Mitch would lead you to believe, I agree.  I have
no problem with someone just wanting a basic IIGS setup or
run AWGS off a floppy drive.

The debate is not what is the "proper" IIGS setup.  Everyone's
idea is different.

The debate is the definition of the word setup.  There are $300+
IIGS SETUPS but of course no $300+ IIGS.

And if you think "why the heck are we arguing about the definition
of setup?"  It is because Mitch does not seem to know what it is
and equates my statement that there are $300+ IIGS SETUPS to
"Supertimer thinks a IIGS is worth $300."  I don't and I wish he'd
stop making me out to be some kind of lunatic who wants to make the
world think that the IIGS is worth such money.