Re: ANN: Retiring from A2 world - Good Bye All!

["Steve Mentzer" <dropthistext.smentzer@pacbell.net>]

> Nathan Mates developed software! Joe Kohn sells the stuff! How is that
> tearing down the community?

Nathan mates and Joe Kohn (as well as some other A2 "dignitaries") did
*everything* possible to take down online archives such as Asmiov, Ground,
etc etc.

There was a treasure trove of A2 software available, and yes, most of it was
commercial work, and the reality was (and still is) that the original
authors/publishers either didn't care about it anymore, or simply didn't
exist!

Yes, there were some titles that were still being distributed/sold via A2MG
or Shareware Solutions. And yes, we all agreed that this was inappropriate.

The problem was that Kohn and Mates took things to the extreme, and instead
of simply asking for a copyrighted title to be removed from the archive
(which the admin always agreed with), they attempted (and succeeded) in
shutting down the archives using various methods.

Now, there is something to be said for protecting your intellectual
property. I agreed with Joe and Nathan 100% about the fact that stuff they
sell/sold/distribute/developed should be available exactly as they choose.
However, they attempted (and succeeded) in denying apple II users access to
archives that they had no stake in.

They chose to be the industry martyrs for long abandoned software. They
didn't help the situation one bit. All they did was deny access to software
that no one cares about. All in the name of "morality" and "law" and "doing
the right thing".


>
> Your attitude shines through here, revealing:
> 1) You think the A2 is dead regardless of what anyone does (fatalism)


REALITY CHECK: It is.

The Apple II is a labor of love. It is a commercially unviable product, with
little or no major manufacturing support. The only remaining
software/hardware development is occuring as the result of individual
efforts.

I don't have a IIgs because it performs better than my athlon box. It isn't
easy tracking down replacement ROM1 or ROM3 mainboards when a ROM craps out.
It isn't easy replacing the stock IIgs power supplies when they start
chirping. I don't scour through thrift stores looking for accelerator and
SCSI cards because I am cheap and want to save  a buck.

It is simply a labor of love. Nostalgia. Let me do what I will. If I am not
stealing from you, leave me alone to run Castle Wolfenstein when I feel like
it. Dont remind me about piracy or try to make me feel guilty because you
invested more personal time in a dead platform.

> 2) You seem to think developers aren't due appreciation
>

They certainly are. I have never said that they shouldn't be given their
dues. But developers like Mates didn't just try to protect his own works. He
(and others), in the most venemous method possible attempted to deny
everyone in the Apple II community access to software that the authors
themselves abandoned long ago. It was cold, mean spirited and misplaced.

In that regard, he deserves NO appreciation.

> When you've sunk a few months into a program,

.. I have.. I have been programming commercially for over 15 years.

then you can go on about
> how you don't need praise or even feedback. (I'd love to see that,
> actually...a developer who doesn't want or need feedback.) But those who
> sit on the sideline always cheer the loudest while never stepping onto
> the field.

Lets not turn this into a pissing contest.... it will be a terrible waste of
your time.

>
> Since you think the A2 community will die regardless, what are you doing
> here? Oh yeah...scavenging corpses and shouting that the empire will
> never return, so leave you to loot in peace. How noble.


The apple II community will continue to whither, regardless of what you
choose to do. Like I said, for many of use, this is nothing more than a
labor of love. Nostalgia.